4v4 casted replay for zhl

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would you like 4v4 casted replay? (please read the thread before voting)

Yes, immediately cease live casting and cast from replays
14
42%
Maybe, try Crush's "find the xapos" solution for a week first
3
9%
No, games should always be cast live
14
42%
Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn
2
6%
 
Total votes: 33
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4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by krazymen » Tue Jan 06, 2015 1:45 pm

Stealth proposed this a long while ago where instead of having live casted zhl with bench and everything you would have a 4v4 match ih style with the replay being casted whenever the time is best. Ill be honest with you all and i thought that was a terrible idea and i didnt agree and i think most other owners/players didnt agree at the time either however this season from my experience playing west and east i lagged (not delay but legit spikes lag) in a game maybe twice and it was either from my end or not and now every single game my team lost except 1 against peter's team was because there was extreme lag for 1 or more players in the game ONLY DURING ZHL. A lot of people likes to say that those people are little bitch that wont shut up about lag but i think that a lot of other players has experienced the same thing so i wanted to have the opinion of the community what do you think about this idea? 4v4 replay casted for zhl? another argument for that idea would be that a lot of the "usual" casters are never online for the zhl matches and some people that dont necessarily want to cast/stream are forced to do so at the last minute.

TLDR : Have the zhl games 4v4 replay casted for hopefully less lag for both teams in order to have better quality games and no last minute casting notice for potential casters.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by Illusion » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:01 pm

I have been experiencing this on my team in every west game we play. Eric has rarely had major lag issues in west ih's, but is completely unable to play in west zhl games. Our last game Eric had to leave because of it and I had such delay that I wouldn't move for 2-3 seconds after clicking. I gave up 2 goals in first 30 seconds of the game to Maha's team. After casters/stream left all of my delay was gone and I gave up only 1 goal to them. When 1 player lags, as in the case of Eric, I can replace him, but a team getting 2 free goals is just ridiculous. I have now heard issues with casters/stream from not one, but many in the community. I understand that people want live games, but I believe that more quality games are in the best interest of zealot hockey. Do we want to see the teams at their best? Or are we all hoping for free wins when a team is rekt by the stream?
Last edited by Illusion on Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by xNCrush » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:12 pm

I'm torn on this one because knowing you're watching something live makes such a difference from something you know has already past. And a lot of the time it isn't the caster (I've been called out three times, and all three times me leaving didn't impact the game).

I think a better solution would be to get a feel for which casters seem to have the xapos effect when they have the stream running. So far Teroh, (normally) Kurt, myself and Moose all have had no recorded instances of being the source of the lag. Tom was unquestioningly the source of the lag in Mar Sara vs Kaldir. But tom also had games where he wasn't causing any lag.

I think the history of issues on Sunday could be influenced by network traffic. We've got a history of issues on Sunday nights, but weekday games almost never seem to have lag. Sometimes it's okay, sometimes it's not.

So yeah, I say try to use casters that have no history of affecting gameplay. If there is lag issues, get the casters to leave, and if lag doesn't improve, remake and bring the casters back in (because live ZHL is best ZHL). If the casters leaving resolves the issue, then we cast from replay at some other time.

But in general, cast live! Pls!

Also, make sure all your players are not trying to watch the stream while they play. And if you have a shitty internet provider, a family addicted to Netflix, or a potato computer, I'm sorry but you're going to have delay on high-traffic times, AND IT'S NOT THE CASTERS FAULT.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by krazymen » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:24 pm

xNCrush wrote:I'm torn on this one because knowing you're watching something live makes such a difference from something you know has already past. And a lot of the time it isn't the caster (I've been called out three times, and all three times me leaving didn't impact the game).

I think a better solution would be to get a feel for which casters seem to have the xapos effect when they have the stream running. So far Teroh, (normally) Kurt, myself and Moose all have had no recorded instances of being the source of the lag. Tom was unquestioningly the source of the lag in Mar Sara vs Kaldir. But tom also had games where he wasn't causing any lag.

I think the history of issues on Sunday could be influenced by network traffic. We've got a history of issues on Sunday nights, but weekday games almost never seem to have lag. Sometimes it's okay, sometimes it's not.

So yeah, I say try to use casters that have no history of affecting gameplay. If there is lag issues, get the casters to leave, and if lag doesn't improve, remake and bring the casters back in (because live ZHL is best ZHL). If the casters leaving resolves the issue, then we cast from replay at some other time.

But in general, cast live! Pls!

Also, make sure all your players are not trying to watch the stream while they play. And if you have a shitty internet provider, a family addicted to Netflix, or a potato computer, I'm sorry but you're going to have delay on high-traffic times, AND IT'S NOT THE CASTERS FAULT.
i feel like instead of hoping for no lag with casters and bench and then theres lag and have to pause every 2 seconds kick bench then retry then pause again then kick caster and have to have radio cast detroys completely a game rather than simply have that in a replay you could still have the replay casted on a set day with set casters that actually wants to casts people could tune in as if it was live we could have less down time and we could even have organised votes for stuff or predictions and whatever you could time whatever you like since you know there wont be any issues with the replay.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by l)arkangel » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:35 pm

I think we'll lose a lot of viewers if we do it this way. Once the results of a game have been leaked by a player, the game becomes that much less interesting.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by xNCrush » Tue Jan 06, 2015 2:56 pm

It only removes one step to not have casters there at the beginning. Saves you maybe 2 minutes. And if you never have casters, you don't have anyone that can use the mod commands to set time/score in the event that a remake happens after a goal has been scored. And then you'd have fragmented replays that is still messy to cast.

This should be the protocol for laggy ZHL games imo:

- Game enters "find the xapos" mode. No goals are counted during this time.
- Without pausing, one player at a time from the bench leaves
- For each player that leaves, see if lag goes away
- If the lag persists, have the casters leave one at a time (start with color, then the streamer)
- If the lag persists, one player at a time from each team leaves the game
- Continue until the lag is gone.
- If the casters are not the source, remake the game to get the casters back in.

Benefits:
- Because the casters are almost never the actual source, we still get live casted ZHL
- You know exactly who the xapos is
- At most one remake should resolve the issue

Cons:
- Literally nothing
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by Ranchinator » Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:03 pm

I agree with what Crush said in both his first and second post. In the redlings game I noticed that Alerteyes had the stream open and Perplex did also. I didnt watch the Mar Sara and Kaldir game. But this could have been the issue also
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by Illusion » Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:11 pm

I don't agree with this "the casters are almost never the source" nonsense. Many people are complaining about lag and delay in zhl games when we never have any issues in ih games. The only difference is that it is being streamed. It most definitely is the streaming.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by xNCrush » Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:14 pm

Prime, how many times has casters leaving fixed the problem? Our game was the first time I've ever seen it actually improve the game.

How many IH get played on Sunday night? Almost none. Maybe I'll throw up my personal twitch the next time I'm doing some IH and see if people notice. Bet you a lot they don't.
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Re: 4v4 casted replay for zhl

Post by krazymen » Tue Jan 06, 2015 3:21 pm

xNCrush wrote:It only removes one step to not have casters there at the beginning. Saves you maybe 2 minutes. And if you never have casters, you don't have anyone that can use the mod commands to set time/score in the event that a remake happens after a goal has been scored. And then you'd have fragmented replays that is still messy to cast.

This should be the protocol for laggy ZHL games imo:

- Game enters "find the xapos" mode. No goals are counted during this time.
- Without pausing, one player at a time from the bench leaves
- For each player that leaves, see if lag goes away
- If the lag persists, have the casters leave one at a time (start with color, then the streamer)
- If the lag persists, one player at a time from each team leaves the game
- Continue until the lag is gone.
- If the casters are not the source, remake the game to get the casters back in.

Benefits:
- Because the casters are almost never the actual source, we still get live casted ZHL
- You know exactly who the xapos is
- At most one remake should resolve the issue

Cons:
- Literally nothing
what i mean by saves time is that theres the replay is a SET TIME you know in advance how long it will take theres no bullshit pause randomly theres no waiting on server creating theres no delay for missing players theres no delay on finding a caster if no one is online. We can also have it so theres an "admin" or a referee in the 4v4 just to make sure everything is in check and he could do the time changing or wahtever if it is needed. Your method of finding the lag source would take forever and would instantly kill the viewer base. I wouldnt stay to watch players leave 1 by 1 to determine whos lagging the game and then wait again for the hosting team to host right server then wait again to replace players and then see if its not laggy what if the game is still laggy after that? do it again? Im not saying that the casters are the source of the lag but i find it odd that theres been lag with a lot of people during zhl and not in ih.
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