Perhaps it might be time for a debate

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l)arkangel
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by l)arkangel » Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:17 am

74% currently support change to bitchwalking with a 31 player sample size
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by krazymen » Thu Aug 20, 2015 3:11 pm

TM never said unanimous he said if it was 1 sided a change should be made and 74% for a change is pretty damn 1 sided.
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by Watermelon » Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:51 pm

Imagine if, in regular SC2, photon cannons had twice as much HP and built twice as fast. Imagine watching GSL and seeing players start reverting to nothing but cannon rushes, as it is the most viable strategy to win. You'd ultimately see everyone switch to Protoss and do nothing but cannon rushes. Is it immoral or "cowardly" for these players to be cannon rushing? Absolutely not, it gives them the highest chance to win, and they would be fucking retarded not to do it. Would cannon rushes have to be nerfed? Absolutely. Why? It's boring to play, boring to watch, and it really detracts from the rest of the game.

TL;DR

There is nothing wrong with players who choose to bitchwalk, as it is currently a viable strategy in zealot hockey, in accordance with the rules, which increases your chances of winning. There is absolutely nothing wrong with someone following the rules in order to win.

However,

Bitchwalking needs to be nerfed, as there is no counter to it besides "not letting the opponent score first" or "hoping the other team does something stupid" (watch my game from last night, we were down 1-2 but our opponent attempted to score on a 2v1 instead of continuing to bitchwalk). Bitchwalking detracts from the entertainment value of ZHL for players, casters, and viewers.


This thread is 9 pages long because of miscommunication, not solid arguments.

To the people BM'ing other players for bitchwalking: Shut the fuck up. It is silly to verbally attack someone for following the rules in order to win. That's like attacking someone for hosting east server against a west-focused team. "How dare you take advantage of rational decision making to beat us, pussy nerd loser! Stop using your brain and be a dimwitted caveman like me!"

To the people twisting "anti-bitchwalk" comments into personal attacks: Shut the fuck up. It is silly to assume that whenever someone says "bitchwalking needs to be nerfed", they are insulting your personal choice to use it in a game. "You think bitchwalking needs to be nerfed? How dare you insult my playstyle, you salty loser! Just because you lost doesn't mean you have the right to attack me! Grow up!"
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by l)arkangel » Thu Aug 20, 2015 6:15 pm

^ wot a post
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by wawmoose » Thu Aug 20, 2015 6:55 pm

As game-play solutions are still a very long way off, a refereeing solution that discourages/somewhat punishes bitchwalking seems the best option right now.

I still need to discuss the details with my managers and casters before I tell owners and public about our 'temporary' league solution to bitchwalking. Expect that to be out before either this Sunday or next Sunday's games.
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by Blitz » Thu Aug 20, 2015 7:36 pm

wawmoose wrote:As game-play solutions are still a very long way off, a refereeing solution that discourages/somewhat punishes bitchwalking seems the best option right now.

I still need to discuss the details with my managers and casters before I tell owners and public about our 'temporary' league solution to bitchwalking. Expect that to be out before either this Sunday or next Sunday's games.
Any form of opinionated judgement from a caster telling a player what they can and can't do isn't appropriate in my opinion. The only fair way is a systematic fashion (game-play oriented). Don't try to make some massive change to the gameplay via "referees". Wait for next season to do this, allow TM some time to make decisions whether or not he wants to change a strategy of the game this much. @Moose if you force some sort of referee rules to prevent bitchwalking, you are going to turn away so many people from ZHL. :oops:
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by JMoney » Thu Aug 20, 2015 7:40 pm

I find it a little unfortunate that the same caster that was heavily implying we were bitchwalking vs the renegades had a pre-rehearsed bitchwalk strategy

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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by htcp » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:03 am

JMoney wrote:I find it a little unfortunate that the same caster that was heavily implying we were bitchwalking vs the renegades had a pre-rehearsed bitchwalk strategy

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pls mr money, there was no implication that I was calling out your team on bitchwalking and I didn't even think you were. i'm still of the opinion that whenever someone figures out a way to either remove bitchwalking through game mechanics or through the casters / management without ruining the games original experience I'm fully on board of that change.

also this pre-rehearsed stuff is silly. voice communication during the game is very nice and helps find out where the safest options are to throw / keep the puck.
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by DerrocK » Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:05 am

wawmoose wrote:As game-play solutions are still a very long way off, a refereeing solution that discourages/somewhat punishes bitchwalking seems the best option right now.

I still need to discuss the details with my managers and casters before I tell owners and public about our 'temporary' league solution to bitchwalking. Expect that to be out before either this Sunday or next Sunday's games.
I think a human referee taking actions on their own is the best choice, this system is used in every fucking sport so yeah why shouldn't it work here too? o noes every1 is part of a team already so decisions can be biased ._.
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Re: Perhaps it might be time for a debate

Post by SilentFate » Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:09 am

would be cool to see 3 referees on the field :D
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