How to solve bitchwalking.

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krazymen
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How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by krazymen » Sun Aug 23, 2015 4:10 am

Moderators please make sure that any post here is made to advance the goal of the thread which is to find a solution to bitchwalking, thank you.

The issue :

First, we have to decide what is considered bitchwalking and what is not. Several people on NA has a style that could be bitchwalking for some and for others it could be just a play style.

Examples :

1. Guerilla and other defensive players staying a long time in their zone in order to do a safe pass.

2. Maha and proster like possession where they will challenge players a lot and use their boost to get past certain player, however they will have to wait for their boost to recharge in order to get past other players in their path which will lead to extended possession. Also, waits for a perfect pass which will end up in a long possession.

3. Goalies going outside their crease and waiting a long time in order to find the perfect pass.

All those examples ends up losing a lot of possession time for the opposing team, however they are widely not considered bitchwalking. Most people would want to see bitchwalking disappear and have those styles stay the same way. That is the main issue if we do not have a fixed and easy definition of bitchwalking it gets confusing to regulate.

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Fixing the issue

Everyone has done a tremendous job trying to find solutions to the problem however I think we have not been looking at the problem at the right angle.

I dont think that bitchwalking itself is the problem but more so that it is completely fine to bitchwalk at the moment. There is no regulation done whatsoever. I dont think we absolutely need a gameplay change to prevent bitchwalking.

Lets take benches for example, in season 3 benches were issued a lot. We started to discover that the more people in the game the laggier it gets for cross server people whether those additional players were active in the game or not. Once that was figured out a lot of owners would always put people on the bench to try to get an edge and on top of that, there was this big excitement about co casters that came from season 2. Co casting was just so much fun for everyone that it was quite common to have 14 players in a game (4 players on each side + the addition 2 on the bench and the 2 casters). There was no regulation and people would just do it without any shame. Once we started regulating benches and casters it was a lot less common to see them. In season 4 benches were completely eliminated and now in season 5 we barely have co casters and when there is one available he is usually not allowed to co cast.

What Im trying to say here is that if we have any kind of ruling even the most simpliest rule that you can find that would make bitchwalking a bigger risk than a reward, teams would not bitchwalk in the first place.

Some people are scared that rules regulating bitchwalking might increase the frequency of risky offensive plays and yolo boosting. I think that you see those happen already however they happen the most when the team losing thinks the opposing team is about to bitchwalk and they do not have any other way to get the puck. When you know that the opposing team will not bitchwalk, there would be no reason to yolo boost or play more aggressive than you already do.

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The tricky part

Finding that simple rule is the hardest part of this process. What im proposing is that we try to find a consensus on what is bitchwalking. It will then be very easy to find a rule. In the case that we do not find a consensus to what is bitchwalking then the only solution possible in my mind is that we have some kind of gameplay change that would prevent the worst of the worst bitchwalking. Similar to the anti ac of crush, it doesnt stop someone from using an ac completely but it stops them from using it at a stupid rate. By doing that you wont eliminate the current styles that are widely accepted and you will also eliminate most bitchwalking attempt.

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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by Marker » Sun Aug 23, 2015 4:51 am

Oval rink. Less space behind crease, more corners to drive someone into.
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by Watermelon » Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:21 pm

I would define bitchwalking as follows:

The act of keeping possession of the puck while not attempting to score, with the intention of killing time and maintaining a lead.
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by l)arkangel » Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:27 pm

:?
Watermelon wrote:I would define bitchwalking as follows:

The act of keeping possession of the puck while not attempting to progress any form of offense, with the intention of killing time and maintaining a lead.
Changed for my personal view bbecause the guer type defense is based on waiting for a safe open lane, not really based on delaying the game.

Edit: meh, mostly just knit picking vocab.
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by wawmoose » Sun Aug 23, 2015 8:54 pm

Unanimity will never happen. We already know most people agree bitchwalking is a problem that needs a solution (see TK's poll thread), and let's be real, the confusion about what a bitchwalk is is theoretical, pretty much everyone will know if it's happening.

Current leading solution is what we did today, at caster's discretion, a face-off can be called if he deems bitchwalk is being used for an inappropriate amount of time (bitchwalking IS tolerated, in small amounts/short times).

To me this is the only plausible non-gameplay solution. Timer use is too much effort for casters, what else is there?

Is it perfect? no. Caster bias? yes.
But if you're not bitchwalking you don't need to worry about either of those facts.

I love my DEVs but I can't hold off for a gameplay solution, we need something in the meanwhile.
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by Blitz » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:04 am

wawmoose wrote:Unanimity will never happen. We already know most people agree bitchwalking is a problem that needs a solution (see TK's poll thread), and let's be real, the confusion about what a bitchwalk is is theoretical, pretty much everyone will know if it's happening.

Current leading solution is what we did today, at caster's discretion, a face-off can be called if he deems bitchwalk is being used for an inappropriate amount of time (bitchwalking IS tolerated, in small amounts/short times).

To me this is the only plausible non-gameplay solution. Timer use is too much effort for casters, what else is there?

Is it perfect? no. Caster bias? yes.
But if you're not bitchwalking you don't need to worry about either of those facts.

I love my DEVs but I can't hold off for a gameplay solution, we need something in the meanwhile.
The fact that you think 30 people represent a 150-200 person league is concerning to me (side question are you a liberal if you could vote in USA)I think this caster-deciding-what is bitchwalking will kill ZHL faster than bitchwalking ever would have. Last time we had a forum argument I said something along these lines and everyone disagreed with me and I turned out to be right. I just hope I don't have to say "I told you so" again.
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by Cubs » Mon Aug 24, 2015 10:33 am

I think what happened yesterday with it was fine, but Halo enforcing a 10-15 sec bitchwalk rule on a team playing 3v4 was a little over the top.
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by PeterDLai » Mon Aug 24, 2015 2:54 pm

ib4 Zerus blitzwalks anyway and forces faceoffs over and over
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by daggius » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:30 pm

These solutions are contrived and absurd. If u are good enough to score 1 goal and then keep the puck away from the other team for the rest of the game then you deserve to win anyways. It's not basketball where there are shot clocks and back court violations etc -- and why should we aspire to turn it into that? Furthermore, you can never enforce these suggested rules, and any attempts to do so will only redouble the gamesmanship people employ to accomplish the same end while sidestepping the technical letter of your laws...

The reality of the scenario is krazymen lives in a happy little world where he thinks every ZHL game should play like an inhouse game, which is basically an exhibition match. Exhibition is used in a derogatory sense here because its not real. Its very high scoring, lots of back and forth action, etc etc, but that only exists because people are not doing everything possible to try and control and win the game. That's the difference between exhibition and a real contest, and you will never change that with any amount of contrived nonsense rules. ZHL is a real contest, let people play correctly and play to win the game, not to make it a silly exhibition.. we have ih for that. And honestly, what's so exciting for you guys to see the puck fly into the net a couple more times per game if it was done under false pretenses, like a team was forced to attack and expose themselves instead of play how they want to? Its not real; its as dumb as fake boobs, and quite frankly uninteresting. And to be honest, the amount of excitement and drama that a good bitchwalk brings to the twitch chat and between the two teams playing is undeniable and actually quite great. Its the type of thing that in a real hockey match raises the contention and leads to an awesome fight.

Since you guys will never be satisfied with doing things correctly the daggius way, lets come to a logical compromise. The best and least contrived way available to address the concerns of bitchwalking is to make the rink smaller. When there is less space it is harder to play keep away. This should be accomplished by chamfering the corners of the rink (since making an oval rink is practically impossible). Just chop off some amount of the corners with a nice 45 degree cut and you have reduced the space behind the net as well as brought us closer to the geometry of an actual hockey rink. Do it now and hush up the ignorant crying about bitchwalk. Half the reason bitchwalk works so well is because people just put their mouse down and start crying in all chat instead of trying to position correctly to high press and recover the puck.. news flash, in every sport you have to high press when you are losing the game or the other team will just hold possession till you lose. The first goal in any game is extremely valueable. DAGGIUS OUT
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Re: How to solve bitchwalking.

Post by Marker » Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:39 am

Blitz wrote: The fact that you think 30 people represent a 150-200 person league is concerning to me
Please an internet poll where Krazy created 30 accounts to make a point is completely scientifically valid and a representation of how much kraz... erm the community cares. It's never only the people who passionate that vote in these polls...
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